Interested in maladministration. Estd. 2005
Elaine Byrne: Lacking moral courage to name names
Real democracies and referendums Anthony
Public Services Card: Some still forced to comply Anthony
Catholic Church: Dark influence still active Anthony
Tom Parlon launches new career in comedy Anthony
Public Inquiry >>
A bird's eye view of the vineyard
Moveable Feast Cafe 2020/02/17 ? Open Thread Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:00 | Herb Swanson
2020/02/17 10:00:02Welcome to the ‘Moveable Feast Cafe’. The ‘Moveable Feast’ is an open thread where readers can post wide ranging observations, articles, rants, off topic and have animate discussions of
Erdogan?s Long-Coming Reality Check: Fri Feb 14, 2020 22:04 | The Saker
by Ghassan Kadi for The Saker Blog It is hard to say if Erdogan is running out of choices, friends, time, or all of the above; and his stands on
Adventures Of Idlib Hipsters. American Waterloo In Khirbat Amu Fri Feb 14, 2020 18:49 | Scott
https://southfront.org/adve... In Turkey, it is by now a good tradition to threaten Syria with a war every time when luckless Idlib rebels suffer another military defeat from the Syrian Army.
IRGC Aerospace Forces Commander?s debriefing about Iran?s strike against Al-Assad US Airbase Thu Feb 13, 2020 23:50 | The Saker
Press conference by the Commander of the Aerospace Forces of the Islamic Revolution Guards Corps (IRGC), Ali Hajizadeh, on January 10, devoted to the Iranian strikes against al-Assad US Airbase.
Kevin Barrett interviews the Saker Thu Feb 13, 2020 23:18 | The Saker
Dear friends, I had the pleasure of being interviewed by Kevin Barrett. Here is where you can listen to our interview: https://www.patreon.com/pos... https://www.unz.com/audio/k... I want to use this opportunity to
The Saker >>
A Blog About Human Rights
Latest Listings Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:07 | Human Rights
Latest Updates Thu Nov 21, 2019 20:32 | Human Rights
US Holds China To Account For Human Rights Violations Sun Oct 13, 2019 19:12 | Human Rights
UN Human Rights Council Should Address Human Rights Crisis in Cambodia Sat Aug 31, 2019 13:41 | Human Rights
Fijian women still face Human Rights violations Mon Aug 26, 2019 18:49 | Human Rights
Human Rights in Ireland >>
"A flaky website that purports to be ?leftist,? The Cedar Lounge Revolution, occasionally makes a relevant point or two."
Sinn Féin, A Second Election and The Left 11:33 Mon Feb 17, 2020 | irishelectionliterature
Becoming more SF than SF? on some issues at least? 09:30 Mon Feb 17, 2020 | WorldbyStorm
Irish Left Archive: Northern Ireland, The Labour Party Young Socialists, April, British Labour Party... 06:59 Mon Feb 17, 2020 | WorldbyStorm
Any new Irish political blogs? 11:11 Sun Feb 16, 2020 | WorldbyStorm
Sunday and other Media Stupid Statements from this week? 09:00 Sun Feb 16, 2020 | guestposter
Cedar Lounge >>
The Circus is Coming to Town
irish social forum |
Tuesday February 24, 2015 16:31 by Nuala
It was bad enough in 1966. I'm glad I'll be at a safe distance when The Circus comes to town next year.
Jayzizz I'm glad I got out of Ireland in the 1970s.
Jay, imagine having to live in Ireland when the Circus is coming to town next year.
It was bad enough in 1966.
Well I've made good my escape.
Aw jayzizz; The Free State Army?
Bury my Heart at Knocknagoshel.
BURY MY HEART AT KNOCKNAGOSHEL
(begin quote:) / “The miserable death of a revolution
The bitterness of the Civil War's final few months would live long in the memory of participants. The casualties were considerably higher in the conventional fighting of July and August 1922, but it was the manner of the deaths in March 1923 that was so hard to forgive. The fallen killed not in combat but coldly murdered when helpless and unarmed.
The Irish revolution, born out of violence, but also with great hopes, in 1916, died a miserable death in the back-roads of Kerry in the spring of 1923
The men on the ground, on both sides, were in the final stage of years of exposure to and practice of violence since 1919. Looked at in this light, the atrocities of the Civil War on both sides can largely be explained by a grim cycle of retaliation - the need to hit back for hurt caused to one's own comrades. Many of these men, especially those in the Dublin Guard, had been inured to killing by years of casual and up-close acquaintance. March 1923 demonstrated the depths of cruelty they had reached.
At a higher level, the leadership of both sides failed to avert the descent into internecine slaughter. The Anti-Treaty side made the events of March 1923 possible by prolonging the conflict long after armed resistance to the Irish state made no political, military or tactical sense. On the side of the Pro-Treatyites, the government tolerated elements of their forces murdering prisoners out of hand -a practice they were well aware of. (My fuller thoughts on the character of the Civil War here)
The Irish revolution, born out of violence, but also with great hopes, in 1916, died a miserable death in the back-roads of Kerry in the spring of 1923, like so many revolutions, consuming its own sons.”
END OF QUOTE
About Ballyseedy Cross, most accounts omit the fact that some of the prisoners were not killed by the initial blast, and the Irish government soldiers then hurled grenades at groaning, half butchered men to 'finish them off.'
Well, they couldn't turn back. No way out.
No monument to Staters...................................
Only a small indentation in the ground marks the spot at Knocknagoshel where the five Staters, including Paddy Pats, died.
The Irish State cannot honour them with a monument.
The Staters had no martyrs, other than Michael.
Apart from that, where was the logic in the Anti-treatyite resistance to the Free State government?
Was Liam Lynch insane?
The bottom line was that the Staters could rely on unlimited resupply of arms and ammunition from Churchill, if the need arose.... and that may have been happening during 1922/23 but not recorded in the history books........... so the anti-treatyite war was lost before it began.
So why fight when you can't win, considering all the 'collateral damage' of 1922/23?
Collective Mental Illness?
When the Circus comes to town next year, consider this.
The Irish proved in their civil war of 1922/23 that Irishmen can oppress other Irishmen ten times worse than the British had done, at least in terms of the twentieth century.
So where's the glory when the Circus comes to town next year, when you remember the Irish government soldiers throwing grenades at half butchered prisoners of war to finish them off at Ballyseedy Cross.
"The volunteers may have to wade through Irish blood, through the blood of some members of this government, in order to get Irish freedom. ..................
.......... And if it is only by civil war that Irish freedom can be obtained, then so be it."
-Eamon de Valera, election speeches 1922, prior to the outbreak of civil war.