Nuclear Power, Yes Please - Green Party

by Jolly Red Giant - Socialist Party/CWI Tue Jun 19, 2007 12:00

The cave-in by the Greens has been faster and more complete than even a cynic like me thought possible.

by Dub Tue Jun 19, 2007 12:13

The workers' movement will have to deal with this Nuclear issue. The working class are the only ones that can be relied on to deal with the anti-environmental policies of the PD/Green/FF Government. I think that rotten craft unions like Amicus (pro-nuclear) need to be deal with.

by Mike Tue Jun 19, 2007 15:16

Ireland has no shortage of Wind power; we could be 100% renewable by 2012, GIVEN THE POLITICAL WILL. The obvious REAL objection is cost; but as we are comitting to spending $350 million on Carbon Credits 2008-2012 (alone); there is a ready source of cash.

The not-so-obvious REAL problem, is that wind power is intermittent and unreliable. Simply put, when you switch on a bulb, the wind may not be blowing, so wind cannot be used, without a storage system.

The simple solution is to build a new turlough-hill style pumped hydro storage system, on top of the Wicklow Mts, a massive, vision-style thing, (like Ardnacrusha or the Hoover Dam were at the time), which can accommodate 100% wind power, absorb it intermittently, and generate it on demand (even better than fossil fuel which HAS to be given out constantly, even when it isnt wanted).

No Nuclear Needed.

Irelands a small country, with huge amounts of wind, both onshore and offshore. More than enough, and scope for plenty more of wave power in the near future, if needed.

But for now, we need to build a massive pumped storage scheme to accommodate this.

After that; planning permission for windmills needs to be expedited (rammed through) as the M3 has been, over the heads of the NIMBYs, except in sites of special importance. And as Wind Power is non-destructive (unlike, say, suburban sprawl), that means most places would open up. We need to fix this, and we need to fix this today, and both sides should sacrifice to make it a reality.

by john paul Tue Jun 19, 2007 21:55

what a load of nonsense on behalf of the OP,minister ryan was making the argument for a debate on nuclear power because "it would show that it could not provide an easy or cheap solutionot irelands future energy needs" (irish times today).

not many are happy that the greens went into government with fianna fail,but attempting to smear them like this is pathetic,greens are anti nuclear,so try again OP, why not rehash old news about ciaran cuffe so e can have a 'greens side with evil corporations!' thread next time?

by green Tue Jun 19, 2007 22:04

Sure they are Rights, the same as the pd and f/g & f/f

by Jimbob Tue Jun 19, 2007 23:44

..Personally, he's not in favour of nuclear power. The climate change threat is so serious that nuclear is being considered in some quarters as a solution to global warming. Nuclear dosen't make sense for many reasons such as: uranium is a finite resource so we'll have to come up with other solutions anyway when its all used up; it's expensive; you and many, many future generations have to deal with the dangerous waste; uranium actually requires a lot of energy for mining and for processing; Ireland dosen't have it's own supply of uranium; Ireland is too small to justify building nuclear plants.....

by anon Wed Jun 20, 2007 08:59

The Energy Policy Framework 2007 - 2020
http://www.dcmnr.gov.ie/Energy/Energy+Planning+Division...r.htm
The Government will maintain the statutory prohibition on nuclear generation in Ireland.
The Government believes that for reasons of security, safety, economic feasibility and system
operation, nuclear generation is not an appropriate choice for this country. The Government will
continue to articulate its strong position in relation to nuclear generation and transboundary
safety concerns in Europe in the context of the EU Energy Strategy. Developments in relation
to nuclear generation in the UK and other Member States will be closely monitored in terms
of implications for Ireland.

by former green party supporter Wed Jun 20, 2007 09:10

While I'm appalled at the greens going in with fianna fail, i have to admit the way the media have been playing this nuclear story is ridiculous.

If you listen to what the guy says he's clearly against nuclear eneergy, when he says "lets have a debate" the implied context was "lets have a debate and put this shite notion of nuclear energy to bed for good."

And he may have a point because theres been plenty of musing since last year about nuclear energy, starting with that stupid poll of so called business leaders last year. So a public debate that nails the point home would be welcome, it's an extremely easy debate to win after all and it might reduce some of the positive spin the notion has been getting.

by Balthasar Thu Jun 21, 2007 09:08

I agree that Eamonn Ryan is completely opposed to nuclear power and that this kind of reporting is disingenuous.

However, it’ll be more interesting to see how Ryan handles the ESB’s proposal to build a 420MW closed-cycle gas plant at Aghada. The greens have committed in their programme for government to substantially increase the amount of electricity generated using renewables. This will require the building of suitable complementary power plants whose output can be varied. All new fossil fuel plants should have a variable power output, (a requirement acknowledged by the greens). But the plant proposed for Aghada is the wrong type of plant as it isn’t suited to variable output. It’s time to see if the greens can implement the policies that they were most committed to when they signed up to join government.

by rodeo Thu Jun 21, 2007 23:40

Another Irish solution to an Irish problem.

In a mirror image of the way as we export our abortion embarassment to England, a nuclear-free Ireland will, within a few years be importing nuclear-generated electricity from France and the UK via interconnector.

Abortion? Nuclear power? Not in our holy environmentally-pure backyard!

p.s. Could one of the many Indymedia contributors who developed Russian contacts in the Soviet years use their good offices to procure a decommissioned nuclear sub or two from the Ruskies. It could then be parked on the sea-bottom off the Kish and connected up to the grid via underwater cable to Ringsend. Voila! A secure power-supply at a knock-down price - and no unsightly wind-towers interfering with the sea-view from the Wicklow coast.

by True Green Sat Jun 23, 2007 11:12

How can people honestly say Ryan is against nuclear power generation in Ireland when he clearly says, 'nuclear may do something in the area of power generation….the nature of this crisis means we have to look at everything'.

To me, and to any person not blinded by the glamour of a Dail seat, this is a clear indication of a mind that sees neclear power as an alternative means of generating power at this time of energy crisis.

It is understandable that Green Party members are adamant the Minister is against nuclear power but in the face of what he said they are only compounding his hipocrisy with their own. Good luck with that denial but unfortunately the people who voted Green because of the feined Green Party opposition to the use of Shannon airport by the US military, the destruction of ancient sites at Tara and the long assumed and stated opposition to nuclear power.

There was no debate on nuclear power in the Green Party. It is has long since been put to bed. Now this hypocrite wants to open it up. Sell it how you will but do not depend on genuine environmentalist to be so enamoured by a few nice spaces in the Dail and Seanad that they will every vote for your party as long as any of you are in it, ever again. You have all seen you last electoral victory. Enjoy being the go-boys for the FF/PD government all long as it suits them.

by radical jonny Sat Jun 23, 2007 11:14

To my mind, one of the great problems with democracy as it is practiced in the modern state is that it allows politicians to 'benefit' from legislation whether they opposed it or not.

The situation might play out like this: Green politicians oppose nuclear power and vote against it on principle, knowing full well they'll be outvoted. Nuclear power goes ahead, Greens shake their heads and say, 'well, we opposed it, but what can you do?' They stay in government and reap financial benefits from power companies with their principles firmly intact. Political life goes on.

If nuclear power went ahead, would they resign en masse?

I doubt it...